If you donated money to the Library Campaign, then, yes, you have been scammed.
You were told that every library was to get a full set of "The Basics". You were even told this was accomplished. It never happened. Oh, yes, the books were probably all sent, but the project never accomplished even a small fraction of its goal.
Because of limited shelf space, all libraries handle unsolicited donations the same way. They throw the unasked for books in the dollar bin, or they give them to someone, or they just throw them away. This is exactly what happened to the books you paid for. This is very easy to check. Go check all the libraries in your town. Have your Scientology friends go check all the libraries in their towns. You will find that, for an overwhelming majority of libraries, those donated books never made it to the shelves.
And you have to be asking yourself several questions about this. Why didn't the Library Campaign people know this? This isn't secret information. The libraries will tell you this up front. The Library Campaign people let millions of dollars go to waste because they didn't do the most basic of checks. Or maybe they did, but that interfered with their fund-raising.
You should also be asking yourself this: If this was such an important project, and if Bridge Publications, who printed the books, thought it was so important, why did you have to pay full, retail price for the donated books? And why are all those sets showing up on EBay, priced for a dollar.
What was important? Getting full, retail price from you for lots of book sets? Oh yes! Actually getting the books onto library shelves? Not so much.
Yes, you got scammed.
If you made any donations to the "Ideal Org" Campaign, then yes, you got scammed.
You thought your local church would end up owning their own building and never pay rent again. This is not true. If your local church ever buys a building, the building's ownership will be transferred immediately to "International Landlord". The building and all the expensive renovations done to it are all the sole possession of International Management.
And that "never pay rent again"? Well, if Miscavige has funded any of the purchase or the renovations, then there will be rent due every month. Even though Miscavige's money originally came from Scientologists, maybe even you, he still will insist on charging rent.
And the chances of the new building solving your local church's problems? Slim to none. Since your local church wasn't hurting for space, and since the old quarters weren't that bad looking, a new building simply isn't the solution. But it is a very expensive, wrong solution.
What was important? Getting millions and millions of dollars from Scientologists for real estate going to International Management? Oh, yes! Solving the local church's actual problems? No, not so much.
Yes, you got scammed.
If you sent donations to the IAS (International Association of Scientologists), then, yes, you did get scammed.
You are, I am sure, under the impression that your donations were going to some soon-to-be-released dissemination campaign or were going to "fight the psychiatrists" or some such.
Nope. A very big portion of your donations went to multi-million dollar out-of-court settlements. In simple terms, it means the Church of Scientology committed criminal acts, was taken to court, was very certain to lose the case and "settled". They have paid many, many, many millions to various plaintiffs over the years to keep from officially losing all those cases.
But they paid these huge settlements from your money. Not only that, they paid their lawyers more millions of dollars -- from your money.
You didn't commit the crimes, you weren't guilty of anything, but you paid!
What was important? Getting money from Scientologists to pay for court costs and settlement costs so that the Church of Scientology doesn't have to pay? Oh, yes! Helping Scientologists? Not so much.
Yes, you were scammed.
If you donated to Super Power, then yes, you got scammed.
This may be the best and longest-running scam in Scientology. Let me explain.
First, do you know what the building was called around the Flag Land Base? It was called "the Flag Annex". Yes, the building was always intended to primarily be expansion space for the Flag Land Base. It was called "Super Power" elsewhere because that raised more money.
Second, do you know that, at last count, they raised four times as much money as they needed? It was such a good money maker, they kept using it to just raise money. What for? Who cares? It was so easy to raise money for "Super Power"! Tons of money has been raised and spent for things you didn't agree to support.
Of course, you know that they never finished it. They got very, very close to finishing it and then quit. Why? Several reasons. One was that David Miscavige wanted a big chunk of the building for his own personal apartments, very lush, very secure, but couldn't decide on all the features he wanted to include. That took forever!
And, the primary reason the Super Power Building has never been finished: If Miscavige finishes the Super Power building, people are going to expect Super Power to be delivered. That's a problem! You see, they can't figure out how to actually deliver Super Power. What L. Ron Hubbard wrote up isn't actually deliverable. Not only that, but rumor has it that the few people who have done the prototype Super Power rundowns -- left Scientology. Not the "end phenomena" that Miscavige is looking for.
What was important? Getting more and more money from Scientologists for something that wasn't real? Oh, yes! Actually finishing the building and delivering Super Power? Not so much.
Yes, you got scammed.
If you donated to the Planetary Dissemination Campaign, then, yes, you got scammed.
This one is very, very simple. There is no actual Planetary Dissemination Campaign. Never has been, never will be. This "Campaign" is only used for raising money from the faithful. International Management never intended to ever use the money for, well, planetary dissemination.
They will run a few advertisements on TV to help with the fund-raising, but not for very long and only locally where they're holding the fund-raising event.
What was important? Getting millions of dollars from Scientologists for a bogus campaign? Oh, yes! Actually doing some planet-wide dissemination? Not going to happen!
Yes, you got scammed.
If you donated to the Way to Happiness Foundation, then, yes, you got scammed.
This is another one, much like the Library Campaign. The goal was to get lots and lots of the booklets "out there". Then "success" was reported, the booklets are "out there". Where?
Sure, some are handed out on some street somewhere. But the rest? In some warehouse. In someone's garage or back room -- eventually recycled.
What was important? Getting full price for printing booklets that cost almost nothing to print? Oh, yes! Actually distributing all those booklets? Who cares?
Yes, you got scammed.
If you became a "Volunteer Minister" and donated your time and money, then yes, you got scammed.
I admire, greatly, those who volunteer their time to help others. No one should be criticized for volunteering, but ...
The Scientology Volunteer Ministers, as created and run by International Management, are not what you think they are.
Shucks, if you've gone out to "man the tent" for your church, you already know this. The Volunteer Ministers are out there to sell books. The Volunteer Ministers are out there to sell courses. The Volunteer Ministers are out there to "route people into the org". They've got stats. Scientology Volunteer Ministers are just salesmen. No more, no less. That's a scam.
But it's worse when Scientology Volunteer Ministers show up at a disaster site. International Management calls for VMs to go (using their own money of course). These VMs show up with nothing for the victims. No food, no medicine, no materials for shelter, no clothing -- these are the things that are most needed at a disaster site and the VMs bring nothing!
In fact, the VMs, because they bring nothing, add to the burden of the relief agencies already there. The VMs need shelter, the VMs need food -- and they, therefore, take vital food and shelter away from the victims who need it.
Why are they there? Because the Church of Scientology wants photos of the VMs at the disaster site, "helping" the victims. That's not help, that's a scam.
What was important? Using Volunteer Ministers to go out and drum up more business for Scientology? Oh, yes! Actually providing what disaster victims really needed? Not so much.
Yes, you've been scammed.
If you donated money to make "Mission Starter Packages" available to new Mission Holders, then yes, you've been scammed.
These "Mission Starter Packages" were very expensive packages of books, course materials, E-Meters and anything else Bridge Publications could throw in.
Supposedly these packages contained "everything needed to start a Mission" but, in fact, contained far more than anyone would ever need.
As people wanting to start missions often couldn't afford it, Bridge Publications started getting "donations" from wealthy Scientologists to buy Mission Starter Packages so that "someone else" could start the mission.
Hundreds of these "Mission Starter Packages" were sold, the money banked, the big fat commissions paid. And the books and materials? Never delivered anywhere, still sitting in the warehouse.
Scamming thousands of dollars from Scientologists and getting fat commissions? Definitely! Actually starting Missions? Not so much.
I'm sorry to report, Scientologists, you have been scammed.
Saturday, April 18, 2009
Scientologists: Have You Been Scammed?
Posted by Just Bill at 1:17 PM Labels: Church of Scientology, David Miscavige, Scam
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Congratulations on one of the best articles I've ever read regarding the WAY IT REALLY IS! This is TRUTH. Please, people, strip off your rose-colored glasses and take a cold, hard look at the facts. It's right there in front of you to see.ReplyDelete
Thanks. I believe that most Scientologists are good-hearted people -- and that was the hook the Scientology used to trick them. It is a shame!ReplyDelete
If all that money, time and effort was given to some activity that actually was going good in the world, it really could have been significant.
But, because all that money, time and effort went to Scientology, it was wasted. Nothing happened. Shameful!
I checked the libraries in the counties around Portland.ReplyDelete
That isn't just one library folks but the entire Multnomah County library system. 20 libraries in all.
In these 20 libraries they have a total of the following...
1 Clear body clear mind
1 Intro to Scientology ethics
1 Fundamentals of thought
Funny enough that "a piece of blue sky" is in that mix as well.
But I'm not done yet! Hey, let's check Clackamas county as well shall we!!! This is getting fun!
The list from Clackamas County....
1 Fundementals of thought
Yet that's it.
There are more copies of "messiah or madman than" DMSMH. LMFAO!
Clackamas County is a total of 16 libraries!
Now you might think I'm done right....oh no. There's yet another County library system to check. Oh don't worry Scientology readers I was there once as well and right about now you're doing your best to non confront this situation. But I have proof!
1 Dianetics, the evolution of a science
1 Dianetics the original thesis
1 Intro to Scientology ethics
1 problems of work
1 Scientology a new slant on life
4 Scientology fundamentals of thought
1 Self analysis
That's another 16 libraries!
So out of 52 libraries that cover more than the entire Portland metro area we don't even have one full set of the new Basics books the church has been squeezing Scientologists to pay for to get into libraries.
Now Bill, you must ask these Scientology readers of yours why their church hasn't pulled all the old incorrect tech books from these same libraries.
What ever happened to KSW! And where are all these Basics books at!?
As an ex-staff member, this article made me cringe as I remembered participating in several of these scams while believing I was doing good. After awhile, if you still have a shred of decency in your blackened soul, you leave the scam once you confront the fact that you are participating in organized crime and are actually harming people. Bill, you are doing a great job of putting into words what the majority of us ex-Scientologists know is true about the Scientology criminal organization.ReplyDelete
Thanks, and thanks.ReplyDelete
That's some very good research on the libraries -- and it's true all over the world. Any Scientologist can see this.
Scientologists have this impossible situation, where what they are told from the highest level, is a huge lie that they can discover for themselves!
It is too easy to find out that it's all scam! To remain "safe" and "pure" gets harder and harder.
There has been some discussion elsewhere about the ownership of the new buildings. It has been alleged that the ownership does not transfer to "International Landlord".ReplyDelete
Yes it does. To understand how this works, you must understand the very complex and convoluted way that the corporation of Scientology works. There is, of course, what is publicly visible, which is fairly straightforward, and then there is the behind-the-curtain stuff.
You might, in actual fact, see, in public documents, that the local church, or some other "local" entity is listed as the owner. This is done when there are legal or tax requirements that this is so.
If this is so, then behind the curtain there will be legally signed, often undated, documents ensuring that International Management (or its puppet) is given full ownership and control of the property. Period.
In addition, internal Church of Scientology policies ensure that de-facto control always resides fully and only with International Management.
No local church could, for instance, sell their property without approval. On the other hand, International Management could sell the local church's building out from under them at any time.
Yes, that is the way it is.
There was another scam called "Mission Starter Packages." These were VERY expensive packages of books, course materials, E-Meters and anything else they could throw in. Supposedly "everything needed to start a Mission." But in fact, far more than anyone would ever need. As people wanting to start missions often couldn't afford it, the Pubs Orgs started getting "donations" from wealthy Scientologists to buy a Mission Starter Package so "someone else" could start the mission. Hundreds of these "Mission Starter Packages" were sold, the money banked, the big fat commissions paid. And the books and materials? Never delivered anywhere, still sitting in the warehouse.ReplyDelete
Scamming thousands of dollars from Scientologists and getting fat commissions? Definitely! Actually starting Missions? Not so much.
You know, I think this list could continue to be expanded for a long while. Is there any time when today's Church of Scientology demands money from Scientologists and it isn't scammy?
Awesome as usual! Seriously, if co$ tech could guarantee that everyone would become as good at communicating as you are, they would have a lot more takers...Unfortunately, it apparently teaches them only how to run and hide (and smoke and cuss).ReplyDelete
I would like to get in touch with you. I am working on an article on the CCHR affair at Concordia Univ in Montreal and want to post material from your articles on thought control and why silons believe on my blog For Great Justice.
Your lucid explanations are invaluable. I have grown in compassion for scilons. Poor, poor babies. They are the most victimized of all.
Please, everyone, if you wish to republish any of my articles, please do. You have my permission.ReplyDelete
I would like credit and a link to Ask the Scientologist, but I do not make a fuss if you forget.
I'm quite happy if my articles get read and especially happy if they help in any way.
I felt sickened reading this. I feel even worse for the poor scientologists blindly following as mislead sheep to slaughter.ReplyDelete
Thank you for writing this, hopefully it will help some of the misguided see the light and break free from the cult.
It is sickening. Over time, the scams have become more blatant, the lies more obvious as Miscavige becomes more certain of his control and of the gullibility of Scientologists.ReplyDelete
It appears, to Miscavige, that he can claim anything, demand anything, and Scientologists meekly believe and comply.
And that is sickening.
But, thankfully, most Scientologists woke up. This is true, most Scientologists have now seen what Miscavige is, and what he is doing, and they have left -- silently or noisily, they have left.
The few remaining True Believers are the more gullible ones. Those few remaining Scientologists are still buying Miscavige's snake-oil.
But, as Miscavige continues down his personal Road to Total Insanity, they too will wake up. How obvious does it have to get? We will find out.
At some future point, the only people still bound to Miscavige will be those few who have followed him into insanity.
And that will be the sickest group of all.
dont forget that many scientologists also makes a living out of scientologists like doctors, dentist, printers, nannies, vitamins manufacters, fields auditors, fsms, renting rooms or apartments to pcs, then they have to go along with the church and DM if not they will be out of bussines, some of them know the true but they have to look the other way.
A good point, but more true a few decades ago.ReplyDelete
Today, Scientologists are such a small group that most businesses that relied exclusively on Scientology business have already gone out of business.
The smarter ones have expanded to a more general public.
There is a whole bunch of stuff here which I can neither confirm nor deny, as I don't have personal knowledge of it, but your section on VMs is a steaming pile of rubbish.ReplyDelete
You see, I happen to be one of those guys who actually show up on disaster sites. And from what you write, you clearly have no freaking idea what we do there. Yes, we don't bring food. But guess what, food isn't what is missing in most cases.
All disasters I have volunteered for, from the Asian tsunami to Haiti, there are piles and piles of food and supplies available.
What's needed are organizational skills, hard work and willingness to do whatever needs to be done. Back in Thailand, about a couple months after the tsunami, most IDPs camps were strictly rationing water. Outside of the main camp was a water purification system set up on a small lake. Problem was, in all that confusion, nobody did notice the machine until we came along. Turning the machine on and setting up a cistern truck to go around the camps probably doesn't sound impressive to you, but "details" like these make all the difference.
If I had to list all the good we have accomplished on the ground in the different disaster areas, it would take me days.
Anyway, the bottom line is that we do show up, and that while you are comfortably parking your ass in front of the TV watching the news, we are on the ground actively helping people. You feel entitled to comment on the quality of our work? Well, come on over and put in a couple hundred hours of work, doing what we do. I assure you, if you have an ounce of honesty, your opinion on our relief efforts will do a 180°. We do what's needed and on the ground, people love us for it. Why do you think we are one of the first organization on call whenever a disaster happens?
PS1: My main expenses are usually covered by the Church.
PS2: For Haiti, the IAS chartered several planes to transport directly VMs, medical supplies and medical personnel on the ground. Close to a million USD just over the first few weeks that I personally know of.
Dear Anonymous Scientology Volunteer MinisterReplyDelete
Nice rant, but completely wrong.
First, your ignorant, uninformed assumptions are totally wrong.
I was a Scientology Volunteer Minister for many, many years. Dozens of my friends were Scientology Volunteer Ministers for many, many years. I've been to disaster sites as a Scientology Volunteer Minister as have my friends. My information is based on my personal experiences and the personal experiences of my friends. I do know what I'm talking about.
Not only that, but I have carefully read the accounts of Scientology Volunteer Ministers who went to the more recent disasters.
What I said is completely true, but the true situation is even worse than I said.
I do not disparage the good work that any of the volunteers do at the various disasters. I did good things, and I am sure you did good things. If you think I was criticizing the good people who volunteer to help at disaster sites, then you missed the whole point.
The point I was making, and it is very, very true, is that the Church of Scientology does nothing but takes credit as if they had done everything.
Real disaster relief agencies provide needed medicine, medical equipment, food clothing, shelter, engineers, doctors, nurses, raw material and so much more. The Church of Scientology does not do any of that. All they do is provide unskilled bodies. Sure, these poor Scientologists do what they can, and good on them, but the people already there, who need work and want to help could happily provide unskilled bodies.
This is true: The Scientology Volunteer Ministers come without food - so they require food that should be going to the victims. The VMs come without shelter - so they require shelter that should be for the victims. The VMs are unskilled labor - so they take work that could be going to the victims. Don't you see what's wrong with that?
But what's worse, and this was amply demonstrated by the Church of Scientology's press releases from the Haiti disaster, the Church of Scientology, while only providing unskilled bodies, tried to take credit for other organizations' medical supplies, doctors, clothing, food, etc. That's really disgusting!
And, after a short time, the Scientology Volunteer Ministers are ordered by the church to start setting up Scientology and Dianetics Groups at the disaster sites to start getting the victims into Scientology. We know this, you know this, the church itself brags about it. Their own press releases about Haiti brag about how Scientology is "here to stay".
So, they don't provide anything disaster victims need, they take resources away from the victims, they take jobs away from the victims, and, ultimately, they see the disaster as an opportunity to get new members.
Don't you see anything wrong with this?
@Anonymous Scientology Volunteer MinisterReplyDelete
Let me emphasize this, because I see you are attempting to forward the Church of Scientology's disgusting claims that they provided "medical supplies and medical personnel on the ground. Close to a million USD just over the first few weeks that I personally know of."
The Church of Scientology did not provide "medical supplies and medical personnel" nor "a million USD". Some Scientologists donated the use of the airplanes (not the church) and other organizations provided the medical personnel and supplies (not the church).
The fact that the Church of Scientology, while doing the very least it can do, takes credit for other organizations' good work is disgusting.
The million dollar I was referring to was *actually* paid by the IAS and a large part of it was to cover the fuel and other expenses related to the charter planes, as well as flying VMs on location (In my case, I wasn't in the US to start with). The person who lent the charter planes was not a scientologist, but a friend of a scientologist who wanted to help out. So he allowed the church to book his planes *at cost*, which is not the same as "free". Not even close when you know the cost of fuels for flying commercial sized jets across the continent and back.ReplyDelete
The original medical supplies were mostly collected from other organizations who had supplies but no means to get them on the ground. The church does not take credit for donating the supplies, it takes credit for getting them on the ground where they were needed.
The medical personnel carried on board of our planes were in large part individual doctors and small organizations who wanted to help but had no means to go on location. So the church contacted them, organized transport for them and got them on the ground.
The church does not take credit for donating the supplies or the doctors. It takes credit for getting them on the ground where they were needed. Getting that much supplies and resources flown out into Haiti in the early days took a LOT of work and cash from the church. And in this specific case, that cash came from an IAS grant. And that's a fact.
Now, the part about "unskilled workers" who aren't worth the food they are eating, well, thanks for that.
I suspect that might have been very true of you, personally, but it sure as hell doesn't apply to most of us VMs. I have had many doctors and nurses walk up to me and tell me how fantastic we were, and that they wouldn't be able to operate at all if it wasn't for the VMs running the lines, organizing the supplies, moving the patients and doing all kinds of other "unskilled" tasks. Us "unskilled" VMs were so much in demand that we were requested to provide our "unskilled" personnel right inside the operating rooms. Why? because we get the job done and that's what's really needed in most disaster zones. Not just "people". People who can get things done. VMs.
And now comes a part you are really not going to like. Seeing how efficient we were, several doctors asked us to assist people with... Scientology assists. They knew we had something special and when they were at loss with a patient, they would call us on to do our job. VM job.
And that technology which you consider worthless and unworkable? On the ground, it does create miracles. I personally gave a touch assist to a guy who was paralyzed from the knees down for over 3 weeks. 2 hours later, he could feel and move both of his legs, and for the first time since the earthquake, he was able to lie on his side.
A day earlier, a VM was sent to get a small body bag for a baby which the doctors thought was beyond hope. It was over, they couldn't do anything for him, so they asked us for a small body bag. While one VM was sent to get the body bag, another VM gave the baby a Scientology assist. And by the time a suitable body bag was found, the baby was alive and well on his way to recovery.
This stuff works. I have seen it and I have done it too.
Say what you will about LRH and his tech. It saved more lives than I can count.
Say what you will about us, "unskilled" VMs. We were there, we helped people and we saved lives, and it was in large part thanks to the grant from the IAS and to the work done by the Sea Org members of the VM Int office.
Spew venom all you like. These are facts. Not just opinions or guesses or second hand stories.
You want to see something really disgusting? Look in a mirror.
Dear Anonymous Scientology Volunteer MinisterReplyDelete
Wow! You really can insult can't you? I never insulted you, why do you insult me?
And, do not put words in my mouth and then get all insulted by "what I said". I never said the VMs "aren't worth the food they are eating". Those are your words, not mine. If you got insulted, you insulted yourself.
Yes, the Church of Scientology didn't technically claim they provided the medical supplies and medical personnel -- they just cleverly worded their press release so everyone would read it that way. "A charter flight organized by the Church of Scientology carried 126 doctors, nurses, emergency medical technicians and Scientology Volunteer Ministers to Port-au-Prince". It implies that the church provided all the personnel and equipment.
They neglected to mention that they really screwed up, taking the medical supplies but leaving 70 medical personnel behind -- so the people who needed to supervise the whole thing, to ensure nothing was lost, were left behind.
John Travolta thought up and organized the charter planes, got a friend to donate the use of another plane. I admire that. John talked the Church of Scientology into funding the fuel for the planes, and that's a good thing.
Various Scientologists dropped everything and volunteered to help. I admire that.
John Travolta and these Scientologists are good people and I do commend them for that. I've said that many times before. Go ahead and get insulted by that.
But what did the Church of Scientology do? Let's compare their actions to real relief agencies. Real relief agencies have disaster supplies -- medicine, equipment, shelters, housing material, food, clothing. Real relief agencies have personnel -- doctors, nurses, engineers, etc.
How much of that does/did the Church of Scientology supply. NONE.
But they bragged and bragged and bragged in their press releases about all the medical supplies and medical personnel "they" transported to Haiti.
The inference is obvious. Above all, it was seen by the church as a PR opportunity. A huge disaster occurs and (unlike real disaster relief agencies) the church hurries out a bragging press release about what they did.
The victims needed food, clothing, shelter, medicine, doctors, nurses, engineers, and -- you carried boxes and gave "touch assists". Not to belittle your efforts but if the church wants to claim to be like a real relief agency why doesn't the church supply food, clothing, shelter, medicine, medical supplies, doctors, nurses, engineers, building supplies, etc?
I'll tell you why. Real relief agencies spend many, many millions of dollars supplying what the victims really need. Your church reluctantly forks out "one million USD" for the PR opportunity, but won't fork over the major money to supply what is really needed by the victims.
Your claim to fame is that "someone" gave an assist to "some baby" that was "given up for dead" and this "someone" brought it back to life. If that really happened, well great, but ... that's it? In comparison, real relief agencies were factually saving tens of thousands of lives by supplying what the victims really needed: Food, clothing, shelter, medicine, medical equipment, doctors, nurses, engineers, and so on.
If you get insulted by all this, look to the real source of your embarrassment, the Church of Scientology.
To anonymous VM:ReplyDelete
As a scientology VM, I went to help during the Cedar Fire in 2003 (San Diego County) and Hurricane Katrina in 2005 (Baton Rouge). I was appalled at the lack of concern by the VM I/Cs for the victims of these disasters. It was clear to me that all they wanted were photo ops and new recruits. I was asked constantly for stats -- how many this and how many that and not once was there any feeling of caring. The other thing that disturbed me was the spin that the church put on these activities. When I saw the video of the Cedar Fire (at an event in my org) I could not believe what I was seeing. The video (and some newsletter articles) made it sound like the VMs were IN CHARGE of the entire fire-fighter's base, that they were running the show. It was bizarre. I'd been there and I'd seen what the VMs actually did: direct traffic and hand out clean socks and new razors to the firefighters.
I've talked to ex-scientologists who were VMs at Ground Zero in New York and they said the same thing: their purpose was to get good photos and good press, if possible. They were embarrassed by the spin put on it.
It's really sad. And, even though I don't know you or your circumstances, I know how hard it is to come out of a deep sleep and see the reality in front of you. It took me a long time to finally put all the pieces together -- for myself -- and acknowledge that the "church" was not a caring, loving, spiritual entity, but a money-grubbing business and a con.
@Anonymous Scientology VMReplyDelete
The Church of Scientology puts out bragging press releases about "how much" they help the victims of disasters. Recently they claimed that their VMs helped hundreds of thousands of victims.
Well, I was a VM for many years, I know how that works.
All VMs are required to keep stats. So it works like this. A VM is carrying boxes of food for some real relief agency. VM asks, "how many people will this feed?" Real relief agency person says "50". VM notes down "50 people helped" on his "stats".
The Church of Scientology didn't supply the food! All that happened was that one VM carried a box, but that ends up adding to the "hundreds of thousands helped" by the Church of Scientology and another bragging press release.
The church takes huge credit for the good work of the real relief agencies. Yes, that's disgusting.
Interesting. I read a blog by a young VM who "found" some water in a medical tent in Haiti. She couldn't believe her eyes! So she distributed the much needed water. Problematic since the water was actually being used as a barrier for an x-ray machine!ReplyDelete
Then there was that time at Ground Zero after 9/11 when the VM's main duty was to block any shrinks or therapists from getting to the victums.
I love how scientologists always claim they made someone walk again with a touch assist. They clsim they brought a boy out of a coma with touch assists. They brought a baby back from near death with a touch assist. But they somehow never have any real proof to these claims, do they? I figure it's hog wash since touch assists couldn't even cure a headache or cramps for me.
The IAS money was from members who donated. I have never seen the COB just reach in his big, fat wallet and pay for a round of medical supplies. Have any of you?
Thanks Bill. I do want to make the Scn's on the line aware of one other thing. The Ideal Orgs Scam, and that is what it is, is also not on ploicy according to Ron. Ron said to build a bigger and more successful org all you had to do was sell and deliver services to a happy public.ReplyDelete
First to correct a misconception: The charter planes were not organized by John Travolta. Mr. Travolta flew in his own plane to bring supplies, and I suspect he picked up the tab on that.
The charter planes carrying most of the VMs were organized by another scientologist in coordination with the guys and gals of the VM Int office.
Re: insults. You claim not to have insulted me. Well, then perhaps you should go back and read again what you wrote. I am a VM. You are describing me and my colleagues as unskilled workers who show up in disaster areas to do photo ops, eat the victims' food and steal the victims jobs and interfere with "real relief efforts". And let's not even go on what you accuse my church of doing.
And there you are saying "Oh, I didn't insult you". Are you for real? If those are not insults, then I don't know what are.
Different relief organizations bring different things on the table. To an outsider, buying food, medical supplies and clothing may seem to be what relief is all about. But once you have been on the ground a bit, you realize that just paying for stuff & shipping isn't all there is to it.
There is a lot more that needs to be done in order to actually bring relief to the victims of a disaster. You get told on TV that you need to donate more and more for food and medical supplies. What you aren't told is that medical supplies and food often arrive on the ground and then sit there in huge warehouses or tents until someone figures out how to distribute the darn things in spite of the fact that the infrastructure is gone, that there are wounded people and mourning people all over.
The problems usually faced on the ground aren't the lack of food or the lack of supplies. The problems are usually more in terms of organizing the efforts, getting the right people at the right places, setting up the lines, dealing with throughly confused people who have lost everything and figuring out how to get things done.
So we come, find out what needs to be done and get on with it. Back at the tsunami in Thailand, we needed to move corpses and set refrigerated containers, so we did. In Haiti, we had to set up hospital lines as the local infrastructure was gone. So we did. We do whatever is needed.
You compare us to other relief organizations. Well, try to be fair, then. The American red cross was funded in 1881. Unicef, 1901. They receive fundings to the tune of billions of dollars a year. In 2008, The American Red Cross spent over USD 140 million in fundraising activities alone and another USD 216,000,000 in administrative expenses.
The Red Cross probably receives more donations in a year than the church of Scientology did since its inception in 1954.
Trying to compare our relief efforts with that of the main relief organizations on a financial level is a bad joke. I thought you were smarter than that.
We are the new kid in town. We are getting better at this. And we definitely have something to bring to the table, as evidenced by the fact that these days, whenever a disaster happens, other relief organisations call us up. They know they can count on us and they want us there.
That infant we saved was just one of thousands to have shown marked improvements after receiving Scientology assists. I mentioned it as a (startling) example of the value of a "simple" assist. Most of the time, it's not as spectacular, but always valuable, bringing relief, appeasing the pain, and helping victims to extrovert and start looking ahead.
No one claims that VMs do everything or some other such nonsense. We come, we do our best, working side-by-side with everybody else, and we use all we know to assist the victims...and it works pretty darn well.
We're not making any progress here.
So, it wasn't Travolta, but some other Scientologist. Yeah? It wasn't the Church of Scientology right? It was a public Scientologist. Same difference. One more thing that the Church of Scientology itself didn't pay for.
Were you insulted when I accurately described you as "unskilled"? Why were you insulted? How many trained doctors did the Church of Scientology provide? Hmmm? How many engineers trained in disasters did the Church of Scientology provide? How many disaster-trained medical personnel? What "skills" that are useful in a disaster did the Church of Scientology provide? Answer: NONE
If you find that insulting, that's your problem. It is just facts. If you find the basic facts insulting, I can't help you.
But you continue to miss the point, whether deliberately or not I can't tell.
My point isn't that VMs did nothing, I'm sure you did what you could and you worked real hard -- and I commend that kind of volunteerism. I've done that and I admire when others do that.
My point is that the Church of Scientology did nothing while writing dozens of bragging press releases attempting to take credit for the good work that the real relief agencies did.
You did a good thing, you worked hard. Well done. Your church, on the other hand, did nothing while callously trying to take credit for other relief agencies good work. That is real low.
You are now justifying the Church of Scientology's total failure to provide anything needed by the victims by their "newness". Give me a flipping break. That's your excuse?
"It's small, so it provided nothing the victims actually needed." Doesn't work.
A smaller relief organization brings a smaller number of doctors, a smaller amount of medical supplies, a smaller amount of food... not nothing!
The Church of Scientology didn't bring anything that the disaster victims needed. It didn't even try. But you have that all justified.
Let's try a little mind exercise. What if the Scientology Volunteer Ministers hadn't shown up? What would be different? Since the Church of Scientology actually didn't send any needed doctors, nurses, engineers, etc., that wouldn't change. Since the Church of Scientology didn't send any medicine, food, clothing, shelter, building materials, medical equipment, that wouldn't change.
You claim VMs were vital to organization, but the agencies have been doing that just fine for hundreds of years, in fact they train for that -- so you'd be really hard pressed to prove that would have made any difference.
In fact, it is pretty obvious that, if the VMs hadn't been there, nothing much would have been different. Other people would have carried the boxed and helped the real disaster personnel.
That's my point. The Church of Scientology did not provide anything actually needed by the disaster victims.
Yet to read their press releases, they were major players in disaster relief, helping hundreds of thousands of victims. Bah!
By the way, you keep trying to veer off into a discussion about "Scientology works". That isn't being debated here either way. It is not a factor in this discussion.
The fact is that the victims desperately needed doctors, medical supplies, medical equipment, food, clothing, shelter, etc. That's what was needed, and desperately.
Even if "touch assists" actually did something, this is not what was desperately required by anyone. Here are hundreds of thousands of people in desperate need of medical attention, food, shelter -- the bare necessities of life. Hundreds of thousands of people were helped in the way they really needed help by the real relief agencies.
Do you get an inkling why the subject of Scientology's workability just isn't important to this discussion?
Sorry, I'll debate that some other time with other unimportant subjects.
Funny thing to say, because that infant whose life we saved with our unskilled assists, he might just grow up with a different opinion on their importance. And that guy who can now move his legs and sleep on his side thanks to another of those unskilled assists? Well, he might just have a different opinion on the necessity of assists.
And the doctors of the U of M hospital who came to rely on us for just about anything they needed, including in the operating theater? They thought that our presence made a world of difference for them... but of course you know better, don't you?
You are totally unable to admit that the Church of Scientology VMs are doing any good, no matter what we do.
You also contradict yourself to a point that it is becoming hilarious:
You keep saying that what was needed was food, medical supplies, doctors etc.
And I assume that bringing these things on the ground must be a good thing,
Well, we did bring food, medical supplies and doctors right on the ground and the IAS paid for it.
So we did something good, right?
Yeah, most of them were not Scientologists (although for the records, there were a few Scientologists doctors & nurses amongst us), but these guys also didn't have any way to go there. They wanted to go there, but they didn't have the means to until we came along and gave them a ride.
And the supplies we brought on the ground, same deal. They were donated to us. Not by Scientologists, indeed, but does it matter? Do you think the people who donate to the red cross are all Christians?
Yes, without us, those resources would NOT have made it to Haiti.
So, we ALSO did do what you say was needed. And you are still giving us grief about it.
Cut the bull. Now that you no longer are a scientologist, (if you ever really were one, which I doubt), do you go on the ground and help when a catastrophe occur? Where were you after the earthquake in Haiti? And if you didn't go yourself, did you donate money to relief organizations to help in your stead? How much?
If I had to bet, I would put my money on the fact that you merely watched the thing on TV and did nothing about it.
Anyway, it is fairly clear that no matter what we do, you would complain about it. Luckily for us, we don't actually need your approval to do anything. So long.
I really do worry about you. You persist in being unable to duplicate and understand the simple words I say.
I admire and commend all the hard work that you, and all other volunteers do at disaster sites. You keep thinking I am saying something different. Perhaps you should just reread this paragraph a number of times until you finally break through your mind-blocks and duplicate what I said.
And your insults are getting more blatant. If you can't be civil, I'll have to cut you off. I've never insulted you but you can't seem to stop insulting me.
The only thing I've said is that the Church of Scientology provided nothing the disaster victims needed but attempted, in their press releases, to take credit from those who did.
Nothing you are claiming has, in any way, contradicted what I said. Every time you argue that I'm wrong, you add more information that only confirms what I said. The Church of Scientology provided nothing the disaster victims needed but tried to claim credit for what good work was done by real disaster relief agencies.
But I doubt you will be able to duplicate this either. You really are not giving Scientology Study Tech a good name, you know.
Wait, you are claiming that the Church of Scientology's "disaster relief organization" is small? You'd better check that with your handlers! The Church of Scientology claims they are the "largest disaster relief agency in the world!" 100,000 volunteer ministers and counting!
Well, which is it? The smallest or the largest? I don't think Miscavige would like you disagreeing with him.